What happened to my springs...

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Stakebed
Posts: 1223
Joined: June 14th, 2007, 7:29 pm
Body Type: Grainbox
Model Year: 1929
Location: Illinois

What happened to my springs...

Post by Stakebed »

Heres pics of side by side comparison of my springs. There is supposed to be a center bolt correct? The head/nut should be visible on the bottom of the pack right? I do need to replace all the bushings in them but i want to know if you guys think i should try to find a better pair or what. Would anyone have a measurement of each leaf in the pack? I have a feeling one or more broke and my grandpa made do by grinding the broken end off to look like the others. Hence why the center bolt may be missing and why it looks like they all shifted around...

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also the front shackle bolts were different
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not sure why their different...identical other than the head.
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1crosscut
Posts: 877
Joined: December 25th, 2010, 7:22 pm
Body Type: 82-A
Model Year: 1929
Location: Lincoln, NE

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by 1crosscut »

I would go with a better set. I'm currently going through mine and have an extra set that I will be scavenging parts out of as needed. I don't think that I will need too much from them and they are way better than what you have. I would be willing to sell them after I get done going through mine. It will probably cost you one of your spring clamps as part of the deal. :D
Dave
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Dave
Stakebed
Posts: 1223
Joined: June 14th, 2007, 7:29 pm
Body Type: Grainbox
Model Year: 1929
Location: Illinois

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Stakebed »

haha i had one missing spring clamp, one severely damaged and ended up snappin the nuts off (can see in the pic) one freed and other havent tried.

Whats the going rate and availability of these springs? are the bushings usually worn out? I know this truck was used from 1929 to 1951, had tons of farmer fixes, and probably overloaded lots...
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Neil Wilson
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Joined: February 5th, 2003, 9:42 pm
Body Type: 82-A/89-A
Model Year: 1930
Location: Boulder, CO
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Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Neil Wilson »

Stakebed,
Yes, there should be a center bolt. There should be 16 leaves. The clamps go on leaf #8.

The attached picture is of the early 17 leaf spring. But it shows the look of the stack when put together correctly. This spring stack has the other style of clamp. This is a Colorado environment spring - so basically no rust pitting.

The hole for the center bolt is not in the center of the leaves. So, if leaves get flipped 180 degrees, then they will not stack correctly. The long side of the leaves go to the rear.

The condition of your spring leaves will not be known for sure until you take them apart. But, they look fairly pitted.
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Drew Mashburn
Posts: 496
Joined: April 25th, 2005, 2:25 pm
Model Year: 1930
Location: Ojai, California

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Drew Mashburn »

Stakebed:

Not only do your springs look extremely pitted, so does your frame and spring-hangers. What's your objective with this AA? If you're not going for a show truck, why invest $ for a different set of springs?
You may find that the leaves are perfectly fine once you take the spring stacks apart. It's possible the center-bolts broke and fell out of their holes. This would allow the stacks to shift. If it were me, I'd start by disassembling the springs. Also, you'll most likely wind up having to grind off the groove on the top of each leaf that the leaf above it leaves from years of riding over the leaf below it. When you do so, you'll, undoubtedly, remove a lot of the pitting.

It might be helpful for the rest of us rust-worshippers to know where you reside. Should you wind up needing new leaves or entire springs, they're heavy and would cost some bucks to ship. Maybe one of us fellow Big Iron lovers is near you.

Do it to it!
-- Drew
Drew Mashburn
Stakebed
Posts: 1223
Joined: June 14th, 2007, 7:29 pm
Body Type: Grainbox
Model Year: 1929
Location: Illinois

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Stakebed »

My objective is definitely not a show truck. I just want to get it together and drive around for my own enjoyment and take it to local cruise in nights. I dont plan to haul a ton of rock or anything (but do highly appreciate the pictures/stories you guys post who do!). I know it isn't pretty but this was my great grandpas truck (which in turn was my grandpas truck). I have a title for it and already switched to my name. My grandparents kept the original WW2 "Certificate of War Necessity" it was issued. Its got some sentimental value for me stuck in it with my dad passing and my grandpa having alzheimers. (trust me ive had to replace alot of parts already and will be needing all sheet metal so im not against replacing parts if i have to)

I like to do things right the first time per say, meaning i don't know how dangerous it is to have springs that are all wonky like they are on these trucks and i am unfamiliar with how they are supposed to look. I want to build a mechanically sound vehicle i guess is my goal, looks come second. Yes i know if it didn't have any pitting or rust it would be the most mechanically sound as it could be but for what i would use it for its sound. I know once it gets all together there's going to be bugs to work out but id rather not have to deal with replacing a spring or a leaf which involves alot of work to get to.

It is possible someone put them back together wrong...

I'm in the Peoria, IL area and boy do i know they are heavy...Truck originally came from Pontiac IL (about an hour away and spent all of its 84 years of existence there up until a few months ago)

Rust is what it is around here, there's less rust on this truck than alot of 20 year old cars around here (we've had one car with very little body rust but the lower A arm rotted off the sub frame). I know there is always cleaner/better parts elsewhere but this is what i have and I'm out $0 right now on them. The frame looks pitted but everything seems pretty solid still. I plan to have it media-blasted and then im por-15'ing it.

I will disassemble them and see what i got and will report back.

So that's my plans in a nutshell...Don't take anything i said as defensive as i wasn't trying to be. I'm young and trying to learn what i can about these giants while expanding my mechanical know how so i appreciate the good and the bad from you guys!
Drew Mashburn
Posts: 496
Joined: April 25th, 2005, 2:25 pm
Model Year: 1930
Location: Ojai, California

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Drew Mashburn »

Stakebed:

Sounds like you're most definitely on the right path to me! It's great that the truck is still in the family and that it has sentimental value to you. Do your truck the way you want to do it.

-- Drew
Drew Mashburn
Stakebed
Posts: 1223
Joined: June 14th, 2007, 7:29 pm
Body Type: Grainbox
Model Year: 1929
Location: Illinois

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Stakebed »

Thanks. Yea don't get me wrong i wish i had "rust" like that colorado truck picture up there :D I may have to expand out that way to find some parts. I nearly fainted at the parts collection at Bert's in Denver when i went there :shock: if anyone ever has a chance its a must go trip/stop off point!!! Altho your wallet may be lighter when u leave... :lol:
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spectria
Posts: 1874
Joined: May 15th, 2008, 9:53 pm
Body Type: Mail Truck, Stakebed
Model Year: 1931
Location: Quincy, Ca.

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by spectria »

I think it's terrific what you doing with the Family AA!!
I would disassemble and really check those leafs for extreme pitting. Steel from that era crystallizes and the leaves can just break when loaded.
If media blast leaves them looking good, I would coat them well and bolt back together right!!!

Sometimes multiple coats of enamel can be sanded and then painted to eliminate the pitted look, and no one can see between the leaves.
Dave in Quincy, Ca. I love Pics!!!! Post them All!!! :)
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Stakebed
Posts: 1223
Joined: June 14th, 2007, 7:29 pm
Body Type: Grainbox
Model Year: 1929
Location: Illinois

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Stakebed »

spectria wrote:I think it's terrific what you doing with the Family AA!!
I would disassemble and really check those leafs for extreme pitting. Steel from that era crystallizes and the leaves can just break when loaded.
If media blast leaves them looking good, I would coat them well and bolt back together right!!!

Sometimes multiple coats of enamel can be sanded and then painted to eliminate the pitted look, and no one can see between the leaves.
yea i knew it got brittle when it got rusty. Por 15 each leaf after media blasting and paint a once over with rustoleum is the plan. Isnt there some kinda special grease like slip plate stuff john deere makes to coat them with prior to reassembly? If i remember correct its formulated specifically for leaf springs.

Ill have to disassemble them and see what i got first
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TruckMan
Posts: 132
Joined: March 10th, 2009, 10:36 am
Body Type: Garwood Dump
Model Year: 1928
Location: Wisconsin

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by TruckMan »

In case you still had the question, yes there is a bolt that goes all the way through the center of the leaves. Looks like yours was sheared and the axle may have shifted a bit, pulling the leaves assunder.

Great that you've got a piece of family history! The engine in my truck came from my Mom's cousin, a wonderful man, and had been driven by my father back in the day as he worked for him. That's about all I have in it, the engine. (My great grandfather had a TT.)

For me, it almost seemed that the harder the task was, the more fun it was when it was done. I started my truck project when I was 15, scrounging for parts anywhere I could find them. Sometimes the fasteners were so rusty the hex nuts looked round. Somehow I made a truck out of it all.

Have fun!
TruckMan
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TruckMan
Posts: 132
Joined: March 10th, 2009, 10:36 am
Body Type: Garwood Dump
Model Year: 1928
Location: Wisconsin

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by TruckMan »

Ahh, I see that Neil did fill you in. Sorry I had skipped over that.

And yes, I know the radius rods and the bottom leaves won't allow much fore and aft of the rear axle, but very uneven roads and bottoming out will, especially if one wheel goes into a pothole while heavily loaded.
TruckMan
Stakebed
Posts: 1223
Joined: June 14th, 2007, 7:29 pm
Body Type: Grainbox
Model Year: 1929
Location: Illinois

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by Stakebed »

TruckMan wrote:In case you still had the question, yes there is a bolt that goes all the way through the center of the leaves. Looks like yours was sheared and the axle may have shifted a bit, pulling the leaves assunder.

Great that you've got a piece of family history! The engine in my truck came from my Mom's cousin, a wonderful man, and had been driven by my father back in the day as he worked for him. That's about all I have in it, the engine. (My great grandfather had a TT.)

For me, it almost seemed that the harder the task was, the more fun it was when it was done. I started my truck project when I was 15, scrounging for parts anywhere I could find them. Sometimes the fasteners were so rusty the hex nuts looked round. Somehow I made a truck out of it all.

Have fun!
oh yea i know all about the SAE converting to metric nuts delima. some i have to resort to grinding the head or nut off(or bolt in half) or pounding a socket on.

I have a feeling this truck was overloaded alot as the spring to axle clamshell bolts the ones under the spring have some major flat spots from getting hit hard and multiple times. Are these a special bolt? Are they available?

got the frame down to bare parts, still fighting that brake cross shaft....
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TruckMan
Posts: 132
Joined: March 10th, 2009, 10:36 am
Body Type: Garwood Dump
Model Year: 1928
Location: Wisconsin

Re: What happened to my springs...

Post by TruckMan »

I would think you would want a grade 8 bolt. I don't know if the Model A parts catalogs have them or not. A hardware store should. It needs to be long enough to go through all the leaves with enough extra to get the nut on easily. Diameter should just fit through the hole. Measure up and go to the store. If the bolt is too long after you sinch the stack together, just cut off the excess. Now that might not meet judging standards but it is practical.

Yes, I would say that your grandfather and great grandfather hauled heavy loads on tough roads. My kind of guys!!!
TruckMan
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