FrankenTractor...Please Help Me Identify the Powertrain

[Grand Valley Tractor]

Hello all,

I'm a newbie here. I've been researching an odd tractor I purchased recently. It appears most of the running gear is Ford, and specifically, the AA (I think!). Here's the story as I've pieced it together so far:

FrankenTractor - A Piece of NE Ohio/NW Pennsylvania History
8/6/13
This tractor is unique. It's not what I would refer to as a "Doodlebug". Generally speaking, Doodlebugs were tractors made from cars. Likewise, I think it an err to call it a homebuilt, because more than one of this specific design were built. There were apparently a dozen or so planned, two completed and one being built when the originator, whose dream this was, suddenly died. This happened in the mid-50's.
I acquired FrankenTractor in mid-July of 2013 from a friend. He had gotten it from another local (residing in Windsor, Ohio) in the mid-90's. My friend said that this other local fellow had gotten it from the original owner (either directly or from his estate or at an auction) about 1970. I had my eye on this tractor for at least 3 years. It was unique and it was local NE Ohio or NW Pennsylvania history…and I'm a sucker for both. Construction details follow. None of this is cast in concrete yet, as I'm still discovering something new nearly every day.
Two main "C" channel frame rails extend the length of FrankenTractor. Along it's length, there are a couple cross-members. Additional support is provided by the engine's bell housing and rear axle.
The engine is a four cylinder from a Ford model A. Coupled to the engine through a clutch is a three speed, Ford model A transmission. The output from this is fed to a Ford four speed truck transmission mounted backwards. A Ford heavy duty truck rear axle is coupled to the output of the four speed. The entire length of the drivetrain is enclosed.
The rear rims were from a Minneapolis-Moline tractor. My friend, Don, tells me that he converted them to a set gotten from a Massey Ferguson 50 when the original ones rotted away. They're currently 36", but Don remembers them as possibly 40" or 44" in diameter. I've been talking with some M-M experts in the area to determine the original size. The front rims and spindles are from a late 30's, early 40's Ford truck.
The steering column is from a Ford truck. It's positioned horizontally just under the hood sheet metal and above the model A fuel tank and turned 90 degrees so that the output shaft runs vertically, forward of the radiator, down to the front spindle (of unknown origin). The radiator is of Ford model A origin.
The brakes are operated independently or in unison with a single pivoting pedal. There are two throttles...the one on the right side of the steering column sets the desired base RPM. When more power is needed, the operator depresses the spring returned foot throttle to the right of the brake pedal. When it's released, the speed returns to the base setting. This is, in effect, a human controlled, foot operated governor system...necessary because the engine has none.
Originally, FrankenTractor had a 6 volt system with a generator. Don converted it to a 12 volt alternator years ago. There were two headlights and one worklight. The engine is electric start with no provision for a hand crank.
The rear fenders are from a Ford 8N. All other sheet metal was designed and crafted specifically for FrankenTractor.
The hitch looks very similar to those found on early Farmalls, though I'm fairly certain that it was manufactured by the originator of FrankenTractor.
As I discover more about this machine, I'll add it to or update this story. If the reader has any information about this wonderful piece of history (when was the (Ford?) rear axle made...what vehicle was the 4 speed taken from...etc), please contact Tim Ponn at Grand Valley Tractor (440)437-5572).
I really want to to document this as much as possible. My intent to is to restore it, find the originator's name, and give the man his due. Please help with whatever you can.

Thanks!

[spectria]

Welcome to the forum.

[Reds34]

The front rims look like they are off a 2n or 9n. The rear axle could be "AA" or later V8, I would like to see more pictures of the axle end and hub. I'm not so sure that the 4 speed is mounted backwards. The bosses for the parking handle are on the right (correct) side. Very interesting tractor. Welcome to the forum.

Red

[Drew Mashburn]

Tim:

A year ago this month, I attended the "Tri-State Gas Engine & Tractor Association, Inc." show in Portland, Indiana. It's unbelievable what they have there in the way of antique gas engines and antique tractors. I believe this show will soon be coming (or, going now) to Portland. I'll bet that somebody there has heard of Franken Tractors. You might want to try and contact this association to see if they have any info about your tractor.

I saw a couple of AA trucks there too.

Good Luck!
-- Drew

[Bob C]

I agree with Red that the 4-speed is not backwards, the only advantage I can see to
putting it in backwards it if you want to plow at 60 MPH. I think the front wheels
are late 30's Ford wide fives.
Looks like the 4-speed was built between Oct. 1929 and Sept. 1930. The 4-speed was
introduced in Oct. 29 and had the pinned on shifter cap like yours, in Oct 30 the cap was a
screw on type.
Bob

[Grand Valley Tractor]

Thanks for all the responses! This is what I need.

Reds34...The front rims and spindles, I was told, are from a late 40's Ford. We sell spindles and rims in our tractor parts store for the 9N/2N, so I'm sure they're not from that tractor. Quite a few folks have mentioned that they thought the 4 speed wasn't backwards.

Drew...Portland is this coming weekend. I wish I had the time to go. But, one of my John Deere loving customers will be there....he'll take pics...I hope!

Bob...WOW! Now, THAT'S getting to the details! Thanks a LOT! That's the kind of stuff I need to document. Thanks! Any idea what the gear ratios were for that 4 speed? Rear end? Are there markings like stamped numbers that I should be looking for?

I've attached some more pics to help identify things.

Tim

[SHELBY MESSER]

The engine is a 'B' model with a model 'A' cylinder head !!!! Shelby

[Bob C]

The transmission ratios are low 6.4 : 1, 2nd 3.09 : 1, 3rd 1.69 :1, high 1 : 1, reverse 7.82 : 1.
The rear end is either 5.14 : 1 or 6.6 : 1.

Bob

[Grand Valley Tractor]

Bob,

Thanks! You're a fountain of info! Can I assume that the 3 speed is a model BB? If so, do you have the ratios for that? I suspect I'll find a super creeper gear at the bottom end, and a heck of a road gear at the other end. Even with those rear end gears, the tall tires would give some decent speed.

Thanks!

Tim

[spectria]

Based on straight through gearing (3 spd in 3rd and 4 spd in 4th and the 4 speed isn't backwards) and a high speed Rear Axle, your top speed with that engine won't be impressive, mostly due to lack of power (around 40 HP with a strong engine).
If you had standard tires, you could expect about 50. Of course then there is the issue of stopping it?

[Bob C]

The 3-speed transmission looks like standard Model A car or 28-29 truck, same trans.
low = 3.12 : 1, 2nd = 1.85 : 1, high = 1 : 1, reverse = 3.75 : 1.

Bob

[Grand Valley Tractor]

Well, the tires that are currently mounted are 38's, with a rolling radius of about 28". Originally, so I'm told, they were 42's, so about a 30" radius. Either one is a heck of a lot bigger than a standard tire for the AA. It would be insane to drive this thing over 20...that speed, in my experience, is plenty fast!

What RPM was considered "rated" rpm for the model b engine?

At the other end of the spectrum, the creeper gear would be awesome!

Tim

P.S. I just ran some rough numbers, and it looks like about 3.5 mph for creep and 70 mph for road. I assumed a 2000 rpm rating of the B engine. I might try that with an ejection seat and 100 lbs of bubble wrap!

[spectria]

Well, the tires that are currently mounted are 38's, with a rolling radius of about 28". Originally, so I'm told, they were 42's, so about a 30" radius. Either one is a heck of a lot bigger than a standard tire for the AA. It would be insane to drive this thing over 20...that speed, in my experience, is plenty fast!

What RPM was considered "rated" rpm for the model b engine?

At the other end of the spectrum, the creeper gear would be awesome!

Tim

P.S. I just ran some rough numbers, and it looks like about 3.5 mph for creep and 70 mph for road. I assumed a 2000 rpm rating of the B engine. I might try that with an ejection seat and 100 lbs of bubble wrap!

Yep, or a parachute, but that motor will never get you to 70 with those tires except straight down hill!!!

[Grand Valley Tractor]

Spectria,

If I added a couple wings, at top speed it may make a transition from row crop tractor to row crop DUSTER!

Thank you all for your contributions. You've actually managed to teach an old dog new tricks! Now the mission will focus on who this guy was that designed and built them. I know one thing for sure about him...he was a superb fabricator. The sheet metal is beautifully done!

Tim

[Bob C]

I don't see any linkage hooked up to the distributor upper plate.
I wonder how they advanced and retarded the distributor timing.

Bob