Wishing I'd Known!

Discussion forum for AA related activities, weekend outings, AA stories etc.
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Neil Wilson
Posts: 2481
Joined: February 5th, 2003, 9:42 pm
Body Type: 89-A
Model Year: 1930
Location: Boulder, CO
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Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Neil Wilson » November 17th, 2010, 11:12 am

Hello nreed,
You should post a picture showing the rear two cross members (i.e. #4 and #5) on your restored AA chassis. You have posted pictures of the #2 and #3 cross member (the front cross member is #1). This way the frame can be identified as a '29 or '30.

Note that the '30/'31 frame has the service and emergency brake cross shafts in front of the #3 cross member (like your chassis). A '29 frame would have the emergency brake cross shaft on the back side of the #3 cross member.

My current guess is that your restored frame is a '30. So, you should be able to use the cab from your unrestored AA and basically be correct for a late '30 AA. But, more pictures would help.

Engine id AA3849258 is for an August 1930 engine build date. This would have gone into a Sept, Oct, or Nov 1930 AA.
Regards, Neil Wilson
______________________________________
neil@aafords.com - use this email for contact
www.aafords.com - AA information and photographs

User avatar
nreed
Posts: 61
Joined: March 15th, 2010, 1:20 pm
Body Type: 31aa
Model Year: 1931
Location: Hartford City, Ind.

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by nreed » November 18th, 2010, 1:03 am

Neil Wilson wrote:Hello nreed,
You should post a picture showing the rear two cross members (i.e. #4 and #5) on your restored AA chassis. You have posted pictures of the #2 and #3 cross member (the front cross member is #1). This way the frame can be identified as a '29 or '30.

Note that the '30/'31 frame has the service and emergency brake cross shafts in front of the #3 cross member (like your chassis). A '29 frame would have the emergency brake cross shaft on the back side of the #3 cross member.

My current guess is that your restored frame is a '30. So, you should be able to use the cab from your unrestored AA and basically be correct for a late '30 AA. But, more pictures would help.

Engine id AA3849258 is for an August 1930 engine build date. This would have gone into a Sept, Oct, or Nov 1930 AA.


As soon as I can get pictures done, I'll post pictures of the number on the restored frame as well as the unrestored frame. Also will include a shot of the rear of the restored frame to illustrate to you why I think it's a '29-30'. The AA3849258 # is off the unrestored frame not the motor. I haven't found the motor # yet. The motor is from the school buss/doodle bug that I bought earlier.

User avatar
Neil Wilson
Posts: 2481
Joined: February 5th, 2003, 9:42 pm
Body Type: 89-A
Model Year: 1930
Location: Boulder, CO
Contact:

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Neil Wilson » November 18th, 2010, 8:47 am

Hello nreed,
There is no such thing as a '29/'30 AA frame. It is either going to be a '29 AA frame or a '30 AA frame. Your additional pictures plus the frame ID should clear this up. But, I think it is going to be a '30 frame.

The engine ID does not matter. The frame ID is the original engine ID and this is what can be used to identify the approximate vehicle production date. If the engine ID matches the frame ID, then that means that the engine has never been changed out.
Regards, Neil Wilson
______________________________________
neil@aafords.com - use this email for contact
www.aafords.com - AA information and photographs

Drew Mashburn
Posts: 496
Joined: April 25th, 2005, 2:25 pm
Model Year: 1930
Location: Ojai, California

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Drew Mashburn » November 18th, 2010, 9:54 am

Neil:

It would be cool to have a listing of all existing A and AA frame numbers, as well as, existing A and AA engine numbers. If there were such a thing, it would be possible to get engines back with their original frames (chassis's). You ought to sign up for undertaking that project. :D

-- Drew
Drew Mashburn

User avatar
Neil Wilson
Posts: 2481
Joined: February 5th, 2003, 9:42 pm
Body Type: 89-A
Model Year: 1930
Location: Boulder, CO
Contact:

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Neil Wilson » November 18th, 2010, 12:53 pm

Hello Drew,
I had started to attempt to find out the engine numbers which originally had an AA prefix based on information from the Benson Research Center. But, I think that one would have to actually visit the center to see what they actually have. What I was using seemed great but when I checked a number of known AA engine numbers, they were not on the list.

Trying to find out who has A/AA frames and A/AA engines today is not a project I would attempt. If an engine ID does not match the frame ID, then the original engine was likely sent to the scrap yard (i.e. if it was not broke, why change it).
Regards, Neil Wilson
______________________________________
neil@aafords.com - use this email for contact
www.aafords.com - AA information and photographs

Drew Mashburn
Posts: 496
Joined: April 25th, 2005, 2:25 pm
Model Year: 1930
Location: Ojai, California

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Drew Mashburn » November 18th, 2010, 1:05 pm

Neil:

I've never heard of the "Benson Research Center". I'll have to Google it. I was just funnin' ya about taking on such a humongous project, but it would be cool if a list existed. I agree that most engines were probably tossed in some manner whenever they were replaced, but I'll bet a few of them weren't. Some owners just found a better running engine rather than repairing their originals.

Thanks for all the valuable info you always impart,
Best to you!
-- Drew
Drew Mashburn

User avatar
nreed
Posts: 61
Joined: March 15th, 2010, 1:20 pm
Body Type: 31aa
Model Year: 1931
Location: Hartford City, Ind.

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by nreed » November 18th, 2010, 1:24 pm

Neil Wilson wrote:Hello nreed,
There is no such thing as a '29/'30 AA frame. It is either going to be a '29 AA frame or a '30 AA frame. Your additional pictures plus the frame ID should clear this up. But, I think it is going to be a '30 frame.

The engine ID does not matter. The frame ID is the original engine ID and this is what can be used to identify the approximate vehicle production date. If the engine ID matches the frame ID, then that means that the engine has never been changed out.


Got pictures of the restored frame and the unrestored frame. Couldn't get pictures of the numbers. Too far gone on the restored frame and to faint on the unrestored one.
First the unrestored frame which came from under the truck pictured in my fist post:

Image
Image

These are pictures of the restored frame that I bought that was supposed to be a '30 but I'm certain is older:

Image
Image

User avatar
Neil Wilson
Posts: 2481
Joined: February 5th, 2003, 9:42 pm
Body Type: 89-A
Model Year: 1930
Location: Boulder, CO
Contact:

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Neil Wilson » November 18th, 2010, 3:36 pm

Hello nreed,
The unrestored frame is a '30/'31.

The restored frame is a '29 give that the #4 cross member is humped on the top side. This is for the worm drive rear axle which would be original to a '29 frame. It is likely an early to mid '29 frame since it has the rivet on frame spacers. The rear axle in the frame is the '30/'31 design. The rear springs are the design which started mid '29. The front end is a '30/'31. If it has the corresponding '30/'31 front spring, then the front cross member was changed to a '30/'31 also.
Regards, Neil Wilson
______________________________________
neil@aafords.com - use this email for contact
www.aafords.com - AA information and photographs

User avatar
nreed
Posts: 61
Joined: March 15th, 2010, 1:20 pm
Body Type: 31aa
Model Year: 1931
Location: Hartford City, Ind.

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by nreed » November 19th, 2010, 2:07 am

Neil:
I really appreciate your time and trouble in responding to this situation. I should tell you that I changed the front cross member to the '31 after I read that the notch where the radiator sits had to be indented so the hood would match the cowl. I also changed the brake cross shaft to the '31 model and had to modify the holes in the third cross member to provide clearance for the brake rods to the rear end.
I'm trying to decide whether to start over with the correct frame or finish it the way it is. Will the fenders and cab fit on this frame? The fenders and cab are in another another shop right now so I can't just try them on, so to speak. If I'm going to change to the newer frame, it needs to be done now.
Here's a picture of the brake rod on the restored frame:

Image

User avatar
Neil Wilson
Posts: 2481
Joined: February 5th, 2003, 9:42 pm
Body Type: 89-A
Model Year: 1930
Location: Boulder, CO
Contact:

Re: Wishing I'd Known!

Post by Neil Wilson » November 19th, 2010, 7:10 am

nreed,
I am fairly sure that the '30/'31 front fenders will fit the '29 AA frame. The lower bolt hole for the fender bracket may be for a 1/2" bolt. The location of the small "L" bracket for the '30/'31 splash apron is in the wrong location.

In the long run, having a correct frame for a late '30 AA would make it more sell-able (if that should ever happen) - just my opinion.
Regards, Neil Wilson
______________________________________
neil@aafords.com - use this email for contact
www.aafords.com - AA information and photographs

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